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Wednesday, December 12, 2007 3:38 PM CST
Culver backs immigration crackdown
By CHARLOTTE EBY, Courier Des Moines Bureau
DES MOINES --- Iowa Gov. Chet Culver and legislative leaders said Wednesday they will look at ways to crack down on illegal immigration in the state by targeting employers who knowingly hire illegal workers.

Top Democratic leaders rolled out the idea at a seminar for journalists at the State Capitol four weeks before state lawmakers convene for the 2008 session on Jan. 14.

"Anything we can do to hold anyone accountable related to illegal immigration, I support," Culver told reporters.

House Majority Leader Kevin McCarthy, D-Des Moines, said state lawmakers will take a strong, aggressive focus on dealing with illegal immigration because federal authorities have not enforced the laws.

"The federal government has completely failed in its role," McCarthy said.

Democrats are looking at creating criminal and civil penalties at the state level for employers who knowingly hire or contract with illegal immigrants.

McCarthy acknowledges the constraints on what Iowa officials can do, but said they are looking at what other states have done and will have a variety of proposals for lawmakers to consider.

Democrats say some employers have sought out illegal immigrants to work for them as independent contractors rather than putting them on the payrolls as full-fledged employees.

House Speaker Pat Murphy, D-Dubuque, said he hears of abuses of contracting with illegal immigrants especially in the construction industry.

"The bottom line is, if we catch people here in the future, we want them to know they’re going to face stiff penalties, including jail time," Murphy said.

Murphy ruled out the idea that lawmakers would consider granting driver's licenses to illegal immigrants.

"We will not be taking up driver's licenses for illegal immigrants in this state, period," Murphy said.

House Minority Whip Kraig Paulsen, R-Hiawatha, agreed federal authorities are failing to enforce immigration laws and predicted his GOP colleagues would be on board with imposing penalties on employers at the state level.

"I think House Republicans believe (if) you knowingly break the law, there's consequences that go with that," Paulsen said.

Contact Charlotte Eby at (515) 243-0138 or chareby@aol.com.
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class of 93 wrote on Dec 12, 2007 2:19 PM:

" Mark this day down in history, not only are both sides in agreement on a political situation, but it is something that is actually relevant and can have a positive impact on our state. Keep up the good work now and try to come together on the farm bill and we can actually say you have accomplished something. "

Whyonearth wrote on Dec 12, 2007 4:39 PM:

" Wow--I only hope that everyone follows through on this. What a concept. Holding people accountable for their actions. Maybe Iowa can lead the nation in handling the illegal immigration crisis is this country. "

Pacerintl wrote on Dec 12, 2007 8:36 PM:

" Hello! The immigrants have been the only influx into the state of Iowa's population in recent years. And yes there are many working illegally but they are paying taxes on that income to both the feds and the state. They are also consumers in the communities they live, No one going to slay this cash cow. "

taxpayer wrote on Dec 12, 2007 9:05 PM:

" way to go Iowa!!! "

olof wrote on Dec 13, 2007 7:30 AM:

" Pacerintl, your defense overlooks the main issue, which is that these people are here illegally. Last I checked illegal meant wrong. Try going to any other country without proper documentation and see what happens to you. Check out Mexico's immigration laws, and their laws on aliens...if only we enforced such laws! How many illegals do you support? "

OFJohn wrote on Dec 13, 2007 8:25 AM:

" Now this is real action, if they really follow through on it. I own a business and know from experience that there just are no real expectations from businesses on how they need to ensure that there are no illegals in their employ. Further, there are no real ramifications to knowingly hiring illegals. The illegals who are trying to better their lives have been the wrong target in this battle. The businesses that have taken advantage of both the lax laws and the basic human nature of people looking for better lives are the real problem. Dry up the well and no one can come to drink from it. I'll be happy to do more on my part and behalf of my business. "

goofy wrote on Dec 13, 2007 8:27 AM:

" Out of curiosity, cause well I don't have many illegal friends or know many who employee them, but how does someone pay taxes if they do not have a social security number? Just a question and maybe a stupid one but I thought you had to have one to pay taxes cause you have to have one to file income tax "

Leo46 wrote on Dec 13, 2007 9:05 AM:

" To Pacer...Hello! Can you say ILLEGAL immigrants? Did you even read the article? Employers higher them as contract workers so they don't have to pay SS OR taxes. The illegals also send most of their wages back to their country of origin. So what is the upside of having them here? And don't give me that old bull of they take jobs no one else will do. They mostly take construction jobs away from citizens. Good job Iowa! "

OFJohn wrote on Dec 13, 2007 10:26 AM:

" Hi Goofy, For illegals to work for businesses that are reporting their wages and contributing to their FICA and taxes, there is quite a nice cottage business of fake SS #s and ID folks out there. That will only last until a non-existant number gets noticed, but another problem is stolen SS #s and SS #s of deceased people being used. In those cases taxes are paid. In the case of paeople paid under the table, there are no taxes paid. There are also employers who hire these folks as 1099, or independent contractors. There are no taxes taken out during the year and only a 1099 statement sent to the IRS at the end of the year. Those wages would most likely not have taxes paid either. So, I would venture a guess that the statistics about how much income tax illiegals pay are actually pretty low. They do have to pay sales tax, taxes through rental homes, etc, but most aren't going to pay what you and I do for various reasons. One biggie being that they don't want to raise any red flags. If someone has more info on how they would pay income taxes, I would be interested in hearing that as well. "

pacerintl wrote on Dec 13, 2007 12:47 PM:

" They are coming here because we have nothing to stop it. Anyone that believes that there has been any initiative by either the federal government or the states to stop this is in denial. What happened to the fence they were going to build? Well they are working on it....sort of. The people that are here are here to stay so get used to it. It would be impossible to round everyone up and deport them. And no matter how terrible we were to try and make things here for them it would still be 20 time better than from where they came. "

pacerintl wrote on Dec 13, 2007 12:55 PM:

" Try to deport all these people and the IRS would go crazy. There are huge amounts of cash coming into the IRS and social security and they don't necessarily care where it's coming from. And for a state to try and kick illegals out, LOL when your business close up and moves with them. "

taxpayer wrote on Dec 13, 2007 2:18 PM:

" I think its about time we tell the government of mexico that since we have the people we want the land that goes with them. "

Casca wrote on Dec 13, 2007 5:00 PM:

" It is a shame that the momentum of the illegal immigration nightmare, has resorted to THEM and US! But for the majority of the American population, its about the "RULE of LAW." It's about a troubled economy! It's about our sovereignty, our flag our language. It's about the difference between legal and illegal! Whatever your origin of birth, you are welcome no matter what your ethnic makeup, as long as you entered through the front door with the permission of the American taxpayer? We are a nation of citizen-Americans (85%), but in this century of a 300 million population and climbing, its about about drinking water and supplying energy to every community. Have you seen our highway systems lately? No person in their right mind enjoys the madness of traffic congestion, that is escalating daily. "

olof wrote on Dec 13, 2007 8:19 PM:

" So pacerintl, why aren't you condemning the government of Mexico for the conditions that their citizens are fleeing? Why don't you demand that the Mexican government fix things there? I'd like to see all employers USING illegals jailed. Because that is what is happening- they are being used and abused. Stop the sleazy employers from getting cheap labor, and they will have to pay decent wages or close. A win-win situation. "

MAC wrote on Dec 14, 2007 6:04 AM:

" OFJohn hit the nail on the head. The federal and state governments have to start coming down on employers who hire these people. Once the jobs dry up, the problem is history. It really is that simple. If they cannot obtain jobs, these people have no reason to be here. Of course, currently the climate is such that we'd rather go after the illegals themselves rather than the very reason they are here in the first place...businesses who hire the illegals in the first place. "

Steady wrote on Dec 14, 2007 7:47 AM:

" pacerintl, so is your answer to put our heads in the sand? You are correct that illegal immigrants pay taxes, but that is only half of it. Illegals pay in over 12 billion in taxes to the federal, state, and local governments, but they incur a cost of over 33 billion. That is a net cost to American tax payers of over 20 billion a year. Our politicians have had the same mindset you are posting about, it is time to get something done and stop running from it. "

shirley wrote on Dec 14, 2007 2:35 PM:

" But we also must take into consideration that the illegals more than likely do not go into a job interview saying hey i am illegal and I have fake documents- so can we really hold all employers responsible for hiring illegals if they do not know? I do think we should finish that fence we are suppose to be building. That was so long ago they said that -that i thought it was already done and they found a way around they fence to come to the US. I think we need to have a better system for immigrants to come to the United States so they are legal. I know some people do not want any of them here period- but I personally would rather have them be here legally than illegally. I am sure most others would too! "

(return of) joe wrote on Dec 17, 2007 4:29 PM:

" $450 billion to the U.S. government in bogus SS#'s. Sure, we get our taxes from them. Also, I'll leave it to you folks to see what an ITIN number is and how much money in taxes that the government collects from "illegals" from that. A simple google search will give you all your information. I also wasn't aware that when you pay for groceries or gas or what have you that there is a special exemption for "illegal" where they don't pay taxes on those products. Wow! How novel. Stop the hate, folks. It's the same old disguise that we used against the Germans, Irish, or any other immigrant group who's come here. Don't hide behind this buzzword of "illegal." That's too shallow. "

Steady wrote on Dec 18, 2007 8:46 AM:

" Being concerned for our country is not the same as hate, joe. Those that speak of hate usually carry a lot of it. No matter how you crunch the numbers the "illegal" immigrants create a deficit to our country. There are some that say the deficit created is worth giving people the opportunity to come here and I can understand that argument. The reason I understand it is because the focus is on compassion not dollars. Monetarily speaking the illegal immigrants do not generate more than they use, so we have to get passed that issue. If we shift the focus back to compassion you have people like joe that accuse people they are hate mongors or racists because they have concerns about this issue. It is not hate, it is the compassion I carry for the current citizens (all of them) and the burden (as victims & as monetarily impact) that is placed upon them. A fair discussion would be where the line is drawn between the two sides and how to find the balance. "

(return of) joe wrote on Dec 18, 2007 9:28 AM:

" steady...as one good example that I'll pose to you: is Postville, Iowa today better off economically than it was before the immigrants came to town? You'll need to verify with numbers, as your "hunches" aren't going to do it. In fact, I'll bet they're wrong. I know the numbers. "

i,of thestorm wrote on Dec 18, 2007 10:31 AM:

" i think would should start deporting people right away, starting with culver...look, if we look @ this subject, we're all immigrants...if you trace your history i dont think most of families did not originate in what is now america...how clueless r u?...why do u think thanksgiving is celebrated?...taught how to survive here by the native americans only to slaughter them and take their land...refugees from europe arent immigrant either, huh?...and jobs, i know there are jobs out there i wouldnt even do, and i done some dirty jobs..with that said if would do them, i know some of u HIGH CLASS people wouldnt do them...but you say no they're taking our money...well guess our money isnt what it use to be and it not because of immigrants...if the US would stay out of debt and quit printing so much money, wouldnt have a canadian dollar worth more than a US dollar...immagrants, (sigh) "

Steady wrote on Dec 18, 2007 10:33 AM:

" What hunches have I offerred, joe? I produced my numbers in the previous post. The only person throwing out hunches is you. Show me the numbers where we are better off econimically with illegal immigrants in this current situation. Make sure you research both sides, because I understand the millions that illegal immigrants do produce, but it is you that chooses not to recognize the defecit created. Looking micro instead of macro I do not have any information about Postville, IA. What numbers do you know about Postville joe? No hunches now, just the facts. If Postville has turned around economically a good question might be if it was done by immigrants or illegal immigrants. If it was done by immigrants I don't understand the point. "

i,of thestorm wrote on Dec 18, 2007 11:37 AM:

" steady, u heard of tax free money?...how about tax free, benefit free, liability free, and just plain free work?...it goes on...but i guess u never heard of a sweatshop...its good stand-up citizens like urself(sarcasm), that stand up and try to defend these actions but what is really going on behind closed doors...i can say i have an unicorn locked in my basement and have u convincing other people i do have an unicorn in my basement only to be let down with photo of an unicorn...so steady?...where's those weapons of mass destruction that saddam had??? "

(return of) joe wrote on Dec 18, 2007 11:51 AM:

" steady...Postville was a city that was almost a ghost town in the mid 80's much like other small Iowa towns are now. It is now either the most economically booming town in eastern Iowa, or second. Housing developments have been built, unemployment is low, and the tax base has grown immensely. If the immigrants left town, literally dozens of people would be without work. Sure, it's a combination of legal and undocumented workers, but if the town had a choice between all of them leaving or staying, they would choose for them to stay, as the immigrants brought success to the town. This is one of MANY examples. The name escapes me now, but there's also a small town in North Carolina that had an abandoned chicken plant (no one wanted to work there). The town was in dismal shape, immigrants moved in and worked at the chicken plant, and now it is a boom town. Immigration has ALWAYS brought good to this country. Have you forgotten your own past? Don't try to talk "illegal" either, as we're all illegal. All of this land was entered either illegally or through broken treaties from the Indians, so don't act like we're some law abiders. We aren't. "

taxpayer wrote on Dec 18, 2007 3:05 PM:

" have any of you seen mexicos stance on illegals? what makes them better than us? they come here and with their marches last year carrying the mexican flag demanding all sorts of things. In 1776 the citizens illegal or legal fought and changed the oppression. I say to all those here illegally go change the tyranny at home. "

olof wrote on Dec 18, 2007 6:26 PM:

" I have relatives in Postville Joe, agriprocessors has brought money to town, and a lot more- crime mostly. Prosperity in that vein has a price. The Jewish people that came to postville and started agriprocessors did so because they got great tax breaks, and basically everything given to them. There has also been many conflicts with how they are running the plant from pollution concerns to labor law violations. But from the start they did not intend to fit in with anyone, just like the illegals there now. Look at the other numbers too, like the welfare numbers. State aid has risen almost 70% since 1995. As far as your "illegal" fallacy Joe, I was born here, and never claimed alliegence to Mexico, nor do I send money out of the country. These people claim to be citizens of Mexico, and do not wish to assimilate. Not hunches Joe, just observations from citizens who live in town. "

(return of) joe wrote on Dec 18, 2007 10:43 PM:

" say, ah, olof, wrong again. Read the four page report by the government itself. Crime is down in Postville, they have brought in money to the community, to the school system, etc. Oh, why should I talk, read away and learn. ftp://ftp-fc.sc.egov.usda.gov/IA/about/ImmigrationBattle.pdf "

olof wrote on Dec 19, 2007 12:05 PM:

" Oh yes Joe, the government report. Why believe the people that live there, the sheriff's department, etc. How many aggrivated assualts or attempted murders were committed there, or in the county before 1995? None. "

hillaryc wrote on Dec 19, 2007 3:25 PM:

" I always wonder when people bring up the old "We were all immigrants once" If there is a complete disconnect as to what those folks had to go through when they got off the boat at Ellis Island. They weren't welcomed with open arms, They were checked for disease and forced to sign documents as to who they were. If they were sick they were thrown in quarantine until they got better or died. Is it to much to ask our friends from the South to sign in when they cross our border and maybe let us check and see if they are sick or a criminal. I mean you folks do realize they aren't American citizens right,,,, "

lookingin wrote on Dec 19, 2007 4:29 PM:

" olof is right Joe. I have friends that live in Postville. What's written in a government report doesn't always fill in all the blanks. The crime rate has risen and if you asked the citizens that have lived in Postville before all the illegal immigration moved in they'd say that they'd wish it never happened. It has put a strain on many government budgets because of their needs. The school has mainly all free or reduced lunches served. What does that tell you? I have no real answers, but I am not an immigrant. I was born and raised here in Iowa and as far as I know my ancestors came here legally through the proper chains of command. I think that it should be done by anyone South of the border too, regardless of how good these people are. "

olof wrote on Dec 19, 2007 5:53 PM:

" ah, Joe, you need to check your sources. You selectively picked an article which provides little to no background. Check TheForward.com for articles on the conditions in the plant, and among the Mexicans and the Jews there. You say a lot of money is pumped into the community? Hardly, unless it's grant money for low income programs. The Mexicans send home more remittance money to Mexico by money order than they spend locally. Crime Joe? Check what the police chief says about the uninsured and unlicensed drivers.... Check about the rates of domestic abuse. Check about the violent crimes such as assault. Yes Joe, diversity is just a wonderful thing. The snippy comments by the town's two token liberals do not amount to much in the larger sense. "

(return of) joe wrote on Dec 19, 2007 7:21 PM:

" lookingin...let's just chalk it up to the difference between perception and reality. What they perceive and what is real, based on hard data, are two different things. I'll give you two great examples. Crime rates are higher today than they were 15 years ago in our country, right? Wrong. The divorce rate is higher today than it was in 1980, right? Wrong. Perception and reality. Read the report that I provided and learn it. "

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